Letters and Manuscripts — Volume 19 (1904)

325/345

Ms 152, 1904

Interview/Interview with the Huntsville School Board

Nashville, Tennessee

July 5, 1904

This manuscript is published in entirety in PCO 135-146.

Interview with the Huntsville School Board. 3 P.M.

Mrs. E. G. White: I would say that Huntsville has been kept before me at the same time that Graysville was fitting up, and I thought I was bearing the message all the time, to get before our people, that Huntsville needed more encouragement, really, than Graysville, because the most destitute needs the first attention. Had I been at Huntsville and seen its situation, I should have taken on a stronger burden. I knew its situation was—well, I knew it was in need of help very much, but I did not anticipate so much need as I found when I went there. And it made my heart ache. It seemed as if it would take my flesh right off from my bones. I have not had any appetite for anything since I came back; I have not hardly. It seemed as if I had come right up to a stump. I thought: Our brethren in the South who knew anything of Huntsville and knew anything of its situation—to leave it as it was; how God could look upon it—that has been my thought. How God can look upon it, how God can acquit them at the sight of their eyes; it has been a great mystery to me to understand. I certainly know that in the place of its coming up, it is in many respects—the appearance—going backward instead of forward. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 1

George I. Butler: It is running down, instead of going up; that is a fact. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 2

E. G. White: And I felt hurt. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 3

G. I. Butler: May I say a word right here? The Board has met there and passed resolutions over and over to do this and that, but they did not have any money to do it. Time and again we have taken up the matter, and thought that this and that and the other ought to be done; but there was no money to do it with. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 4

E. G. White: Well, now, they ought to have sat right down and written out: Here we are. We are just in this position. Now we call upon our brethren in the South to come up to our help. Write it out, and let them be reaching out as far as possible. If they have a heart that is in it, they can merit their way right in their hearts; that is their situation. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 5

I wanted to take a bath very much. I felt it would do me good. There was not a bathtub on the place, except a barrel cut in two. Well, there are a good many poor folks that would like to have that much. But still, how our brethren can know this, how can those at Graysville see it and not say: “Now, here we are, building ourselves up nicely; supposing we do something for them at Huntsville? We have had some help here, and that very means might have flowed into Huntsville. Well now, supposing we should take hold and help them some, and encourage them.” I think it would have been a good idea to see what our neighbors are doing. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 6

It has been such a mystery to me, I cannot understand it; I cannot unravel it; that is, I cannot see how a community can see—even the community at Graysville, that are so well-situated, and all this—and be so silent and let the thing pass off. I could not sleep; I could not sleep, I could not rest. I thought: If we are not going to come into a position that we shall look out for the interest of our neighbors, (well, now, that is one of their neighbors that they are to work for; and they are to see it is a shame), it is a shame to any of us by the name of Adventists, to have such a thing go on as has gone on there. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 7

Those that were there should have come right in, and said, “Here we are, and the board has passed that we should do this, that, and the other, and we have not a single thing to do with. Well, now, what are you going to do in this Southern field to help us?” That is what it ought to be. Those in abundant circumstances can do something, and should do something, that will relieve the situation. Until they can get something that can be done, it never ought to have stayed in the position that it is now. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 8

We will have to learn, every one of us, in whatever place we are, the question Christ was asked, “What shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?” In the place of Christ’s answering it, He put it right onto the lawyer, and He laid that burden right on him. There were the Pharisees, and all, watching to see if they could not get something out of His lips. He said, “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul, with all thy strength, and with all thy mind, and thy neighbor as thyself.” [Luke 10:25-27.] 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 9

Now, God tests us, every one of us, to see what there is in us, and what we will do. He will put an object before us, and He will let that object remain. There is a lesson to be learned where “it is I, it is I; I want that and the other. I want this convenience, and all this.” To let a school, or an institution that claims to be a school, go on as has been done, without faithfully rebuking those that are there, is wrong. They cannot call the parties hundreds of miles away, but they can those that are near them, and tell them just how they should go to work and do it. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 10

Well, I read what I had written. I have not had a chance to get it off because other matters came in. As soon as I do get it off, I will have copies of it, so they can have it that are there; but it is not very encouraging, is it, to send a man in here and not have a thing for him to do with? 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 11

G. I. Butler: No; it is not, and that is why we are trying to raise this $2,500 to give him. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 12

E. G. White: Yes; it is a good thing. I would be thankful could that be done. I would be thankful if I had means myself that I could put right in there; but I tell you I do not have it. I am out of means, and I am trying to get books and such things. I have the Ministry of Healing. I have that, and that will be a help. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 13

Then Christ presents a suffering object. You know they the priest and Levite went by this one the wounded man and they did not see anything of it. They looked at him, but they passed right by. But one came a Samaritan and looked at the man, and went to him, and he ministered unto him. Now He says, Which is neighbor to him that was afflicted and wounded? Who was neighbor to him? 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 14

S. N. Haskell: The one that showed mercy. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 15

E. G. White: That is just what it is. I felt just as sorry for that brother who was there, and I was awful sorry that that brother kind of drew me up to say what I did. I never ought to have said it. They ought to have taken that themselves, after they knew what I had felt. If they knew that my heart aches, and how distressed I am, to produce such a thing—why, it was their business to carry that work right straight through themselves, not to lay extra burden onto me. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 16

And in your board meetings, I want to tell you, from the light that has been given me, there is something that must be corrected. It is this: If there is one that sees a little item, a little thing, that he can hang upon, and if he feels that he can manifest his sharpness by going and spreading it right out, and holding it on, and holding these board meetings, until they are just wearisome—it is just as a man who is putting his foot on the brake, and keeping it there, as they have done again and again, so that nothing can move until they have his sanction. When you find that that is the particular trait of any man’s character, wherever it is, you do him the greatest injury that you can possibly do a man, to put him as a member on your board, where he can exercise that criticism which he has no business to exercise. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 17

There is a criticism that we may exercise, that we shall show mercy and such things as that, and honor and glorify God, but a little speck of an item in the business—it is just as much a sin for that man to take that stand on a little quibble, and hold and hold and hold things in a board, as I have seen it done repeatedly—not with my own natural eyes—but as the Lord has presented it before me to hear it, and to see what is carried on in these business meetings. And I want to tell you, there is more harm done in cultivating that trait of criticism that he will see in time, if he has to wait until the judgment. It would have been better if he had never been born, the way the cause has been. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 18

It is not merely one man, but it is other men. They come into the board, and they think it is showing sharpness to kind of quiz and quiz, and hold a thing, and make a world of a mote just in that way. All these things, I will tell you, the angels of God are present, hearing what I say today. Here is every one that comes into these board meetings where there is some little thing that just doesn’t meet their mind, but they will hang on and hang on, until it wears the persons all out. God is not glorified by any such things. But when you find a person whose special trait of character is to do that way, to do that way whether it is one, two, three, or four men, it is as wrong for that board that has been appointed to appoint those men again and carry them through. They should go to those men in the name of the Lord and ask them, Is that your education? Is that your training? Do you think in such a training as that, that you are glorifying God? 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 19

It is hard enough when you have to bring a point, as we had to bring there at Huntsville—it is hard enough when you have to bring a point that you want to carry through, and keep that point dragging, dragging, dragging when the mind of the Lord has specified what should be done—that there should be a change. Well, I did not want to go in there, and tell what that change should be; it is not my business, and I will not do it again. I will not do it again, but I will say, if the boards that we have would consecrate their soul, body, and spirit unto God, they would see how much the work has been hindered and carried back. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 20

There was a scene presented to me. It was the night before the Sabbath. That is when that scene was presented. I looked out of the window, and there was an immense ball of fire that had come from heaven, and it fell where they were casting buildings with pillars, especially the pillars were presented to me. And it seemed as if the ball came right to the building and crushed it, and they saw that it was branching out, branching out, enlarging, and they began to cry and mourn and mourn, and wring their hands; and I thought some of our people stood by there, saying, “Well, it is just what we have been expecting; it is just what we have been talking about; it is just what we have been talking about.” “You knew it?” said the people. “You knew it, and never told us about it?” I thought there was such an agony in their face, such an agony in their appearance. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 21

In the next scene I was a room where there was a company sitting around as we are here. And there was one of authority that stood there, and He had maps, and he took the map, and he put it into the hands of one, and had him look at it. There were little fine rays of light from heaven that seemed to be coming down, and they were all prepared to absorb the whole vicinity around. It seemed as if light was going to be given in the whole vicinity around, and then that was struck right out, the light was struck out. There was not the message of warning given to that city that ought to have been given years ago. And then that city, he pointed out, and another city, and another city, that ought to have had the light of life in this Southern Field. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 22

That light seemed cut right off, cut right away and in darkness, and now the words were, “It will be a very difficult, a much more difficult matter to reach things now, because the enemy has been getting advantage all these years”—that is what was repeated—“all these years.” “Now,” said he, “when you consider your neighbor, who is my neighbor? Put every exercise of your body and mind to work, if you cannot go yourself, keep your foot off the brake. Don’t put your foot on the brake, and hold it, so that the carriage cannot move, that the work cannot go.” 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 23

Well, he presented it in such a way as that. Now, the light was all ready to come right from heaven on these cities, just as was presented in that first map. But the faith was far weaker than the strength of unbelief. And yet that unbelief, not merely in one man, but in others, had not only prevented the work, but it was to prevent and hinder the work all these years, with their talking discouragement and with their grabbing hold of everything objectionable they saw that they could make a point on. Back of all these was that when the light was presented that the South was to be worked, when the means was sent in to do that, because the word “colored” was not put in, the means was just deferred right on to other channels. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 24

The whole work was so that the colored people should have the advantage—not those that have advantages and have not the prejudices to labor against of color. But it was those who had the prejudice of color to labor against that I was laboring for with all my might and soul, to stir the minds of the people to send means in for the colored people; I did not go so far as to think that they would not know that here in this region of the Southern States it did not mean the white people. I did not go so far as to specify the white. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 25

The colored, then, was the labor that could have taken hold of them, that many cannot be touched of them, but they could have done it then. And there are some that can be labored for now, because they have become acquainted, and that is what God wanted them to do, to become acquainted with what the white people were trying to do, that they were not trying to get a name for themselves, but they were trying out of pure sympathy for humanity. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 26

Well, now, the dangers were presented to me. This was in a tent that many of these things were presented—that is, that which I presented in a tent meeting. Well, then, they began to quiz me, after they went out, and I told them: “Now,” said I, “you don’t understand anything about it. But all I ask for is for you to send your means, and I will write them the particulars.” 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 27

Well, things would come up that I would be driven from one point to another, that I could not write particulars as I ought to have written to them. But I thought they would certainly understand, as my son had been laboring right here, and he had sent to me and asked me over and over again, “What shall I do?” “Why,” I said, “draw from the Review and Herald Office, and charge it to me, and try to help them.” Well, now, help could have been given, if they had a heart to do it. And God would have put a blessing upon them, in means, that they did not have themselves, if they had just gone to work and shown that there was a disinterested benevolence to look after their neighbor. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 28

Well, now, this map was placed in another’s hands, and another, and finally there was a light kindled that went through many places; but some were left, it seemed, left in total darkness. Well, at this time Huntsville was one of those places, that is, that there was no growth; and of all the places, our brethren ought to have reasoned, of all the places in the South were our labors ought to be, there was Huntsville; there the conference had given the land, and here people, outsiders, were watching what they were going to do with that land. They let them see what kind of an ambition they had to carry on that work. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 29

Why, if I had been on that ground, and notwithstanding our writing, I would have gone to our people from place to place, and I would have written to them. And I would have done everything in my power to raise means, for from the light I had, there were those who stood with their fists clasped just as tight, so there could nothing be done, scarcely nothing had been done, and so it has been gone over and over and over in that very same way. Now, God has been dishonored, terribly dishonored, and yet the men that have done this don’t realize where their mistake has been—how they have stood in the way, how they have kept their foot on the brake, how they have drifted back, by some words of objection to one person or another person, or something like that, and let the thing drift right on year after year, and nothing done to build up the work. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 30

Well, after I had that presented to me, I felt just as though I had had a fit of sickness, and I have felt so ever since. I have not relished any food; I eat food a little, but I cannot relish it; I do not relish anything. And I feel such a hunger—well, at times I have burst out crying, and I have cried and cried and cried, as though my heart would break, when I think of the time that has been lost. And to think that any such thing should keep on in the future! The judgments of God, I am to say, will fall upon them, if they go on in the way that they have gone on—so little burden, and they might have helped and lifted; but they think of one little doubt, of a thing that they should hang on, and they must show their capability of lawyerism, or something, I don’t know. The council meetings, they ought to have been the most precious meetings in the world. We are every one to work with all our might to lift the last pound. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 31

If we had done as you have done, we never could have done a thing in Australia, not a thing. There we were; we had not the means; we had nothing to go upon. I started the school myself with money that Brother Haskell let me have, and with the royalty that I had from my books. We started the school in Melbourne, and then we had to work very hard. I went right straight—as I went to Avondale, they wrote back to me—they telegraphed for me to come down to Sydney. I went down there. “Well, we have decided that this is not the place,” they said, and held us back a year, and that meant two years I was there. Willie went to America, and we just went and pitched our tents, and went to work. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 32

(Gave description of early Australian experience, in building meetinghouse, school buildings; etc.) 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 33

Now, brethren, I will tell you what. We have not got to sit down with one figure in the carpet, and we cannot see anything about the next figure to look for, but we look out for but one figure, and just as sure as we do that, we will have just that one figure to look out for until the Lord comes. But we have to understand there is another figure in the web, and we have to plan for that other figure, and every one of us has to plan for each other, and God will plan for us. But God has not looked with any very great pleasure on Huntsville. He has not looked with pleasure. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 34

Those that were there all had a hard time, and I am sorry for it; but they made a great deal of it themselves. If they had just used the talent which God had given them to cultivate the beautiful land. Far ahead of what they have in Graysville, that land is. There may be some spots in Graysville; but it is far ahead of it, and cultivatable, it can be done. But there is the land that was just—well, indifferently cared for. If they had kept it up, they could have raised something; but let me tell you, it is no more use for you to talk about that school supporting itself because it has so much land. It cannot do it. We can in some way have that land prepared—unless they have a sensible company that will take right hold and work earnestly to do those things—but oh, my brethren, I want to tell you we each have our own peculiarities, and God fixes us so that we will not always have them, and we will have a change and mingle. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 35

We have got to mingle together. We are not to say, I am fully capable to handle this without any help, and work up the last jot and tittle of strength we have, and then we die. Now God is not pleased with that. He wants others to come and stand right by their side, and not to feel that somebody else will get the glory. God will not work with us until every speck of this business of trying to be first, and to get the glory, every bit of it has to go out of us, because we have to come to the kingdom of heaven without a spot or wrinkle or any such thing. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 36

Well, now, if that does not cover the whole business, tell me what does. Now I say, from the light that God has given me, Huntsville is a very important place, and I say that He has shown me a community all round there that is watching critically to see how things are being carried there with the colored people. Where there were fifty students, there ought to have been a hundred, and after a few years, there ought to be two hundred. If we can support it, it can have teachers to carry that on as a model, that we have a right kind of a school, a growing school. Now that is what it ought to be. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 37

Does it scare you, Brother Rogers? You cannot do all this yourself, but you can have helpers. Now, Brother ______ what was his name, that was going to leave? If he knew what was good for his soul, and his interest, he would come and link right up with Brother Rogers, and he would say, Brother Rogers, I will take right hold with you, and we will be as one man, we will be as one mind. That is the thing I am preparing to write to him. If he will come to that point, let me tell you, he can help you, and you can help him, if that can be so. “But here is the peculiarity of this one,” you say, “He is diverse from me, and therefore because he is different from me, I want somebody that strikes right in my line.” 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 38

Why, I am wonderfully glad when I find that somebody is different from me, because they are going to help me, or I them, one or the other; and whatever they are, I feel as if we can cement. That is what they want here—they want the cementing power of God upon them, and they want to work as for time and for eternity. I want to cry it out as I have heard it cried out, “Lift up your voice like a trumpet, and show my people their transgression, and the house of Jacob their sins.” [Isaiah 58:1.] We have to get our sins out of the way before we can expect God to come in here and bring us in a position where we can glorify His name. We have to be where the glory of God can come right through us, where the Holy Spirit of God can come upon us, and it can be reflected right upon others. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 39

If you have any critics, for Christ’s sake, keep them away, off of your board. There are critics enough. We don’t want critics on the board. We don’t want to waste the precious time that God has given us, to hasten the day when the truth shall go, because the board breaks up and nothing is done because they don’t agree. Brethren, let us be agreed, if we do not see every item and jot and tittle worth mentioning, it is not worth mentioning half the time. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 40

Sister Lockwood came to me, and said, “Sister White, I do not believe in your testimonies. I want you to understand, so that you won’t think that I am trying to deceive you. I don’t believe in them.” I went and put my arm around her, and said, “My dear sister, you are my sister. I don’t expect that you will believe all at once; but I shall love you just the same as if you said you are in full confidence. I leave you with the Lord, and I have no quarrel with you.” 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 41

Well, I tell you it was not many days before she came up, and said, “I want to tell you, I believe; I believe. O, I believe with all my heart.” And she believed until she died. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 42

That is just how it was; and others have come to me, and said it so, and I have treated them just exactly as though they were in the faith. God does not want us to run in the very same groove. Why? We have a world to work for. There are all kinds of minds; if we don’t hit one mind, we shall another, and then when they are converted, they will assimilate. The truth assimilates, the truth sanctifies, the truth, yes, the truth bring us the glory of God, and what we want is to be cemented. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 43

But I want you to consider that this place at Huntsville ought to have stood on high vantage ground by this time—might have stood there, if others in the South had had the interest that God wanted them to have. And now there may be others that come in among you. I see some faces that you perhaps don’t realize. I shall not mention them, but I want to tell you that I see faces just as I saw when I went in Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Italy, and Stockholm. Now every one of them I could come just as close to them, why, they were different from me. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 44

And even when I went to the dentist, he was not a believer, and he began to blurt out to me as rough as could be. I looked at him, and remarked: “Perhaps you don’t know just what kind of a subject you have. Now, you may take my teeth, and do with them what you please, and you will never hear a whimper from my lips.” Said he—and the tears dropped down from his face—said he, “I am ashamed that I spoke to you as I spoke.” He spoke in a slurring way, as though women could not bear anything. He was going to perform a serious operation, and I never whimpered; I went through with it. You can get up a quarrel if you want to, just by the tone of your voice. Now what we want is to just clear the King’s highway, clear it, every one of us, do all we can to clear the King’s highway, that He may come right to our hearts and sanctify us. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 45

Now, here is our brother. He is nearly sick; he is doing more than he ought to do; he must have help (referring to L. A. Hansen) to lift with him, and he must take time to rest. You are a poor physician—to look at—you look so pale and sick. Say to yourself, Physician, heal thyself. You have a good mind to do everything you can; but do stand so as not to break. We don’t want you to do it, and Brother Hayward. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 46

Now, brethren, I will tell you what to do, my brethren physicians: You just come right to the heart. Don’t draw yourselves off and shut yourself right into a little groove. No. You expect everyone is going to sympathize with the work that you have, and then you just take right hold and receive counsel and give counsel, and work together. Now this is where there is going to be the danger—that these doctors are going to overwork—but you must not do it. The Lord does not want them to slay themselves in the work they are doing. He wants them to be sensible; God has given us sense to lay a portion of the load on those who are going to take it. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 47

And so I would say in regard to Huntsville, I am so afraid that many will do just as they did—without a speck of interest; every soul ought to have had an interest. The interest that has been in Graysville ought to have been in Huntsville, until they got them up in some kind of shape. That is what we tried to do. We have tried to put things up thus and thus, and then we would see what was necessary for the next one. We should have seen the blessing of God displayed, and the love of God displayed; but they have to learn a lesson, here in the South, that they have not learned. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 48

Now the Lord has presented this before me, which I present to you. I tell you, Love as brethren, and be kind, and be courteous, and then we can build together. They will take our advice, and we can counsel with them, and the Spirit of God will work with us; but to have one shut himself right straight up as Brother Nicola has done, and to think that he can do all, he could not do it. He did not do it. It is not in him to do it. He is not of the making to do it. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 49

They cannot see these things—all broken up and all in disorder, harnesses going all to pieces. There has to be diversity of minds, those who see they needed some means to get these things, and if they had to go out and ask for it at different places themselves, they would do it. Now, God wants us to act all around in these vicinities. The work is going to go all around in the vicinity here, and they want to become acquainted with us, every one; we have to let them become acquainted with us. They have to know where the self-sacrificing men are, they have to understand, and God will make the impression upon their minds. Then Huntsville will be the place where you can send the students. And there will be a place where Brethren Magan and Sutherland are going to work, where the minors of the colored people, and not merely the minors, can go; but it will be those that are not as forward as some others. Take them in, and you can just, you may just see—I don’t know as you all can—that they will show that they will respond to the attention given to them. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 50

But if ever I have wanted a voice that would reach all through this South, O, I have said, if I could only go from place to place, and give them to understand what their work was, I would be willing to die. They have to take hold of that work for the colored people; yet they have to work so discreetly! You cannot be careless nor reckless about that work or you will get yourself in a fix, where you cannot do anything. You have to watch every movement around. That is why I wanted to have this school right up, and the school where Sutherland and Magan are. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 51

G. I. Butler: If it was right on the same farm, they would publish it all over the country—either place, any place you put them on the same farm, why they would say they have the white and the colored together. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 52

E. G. White: We could have that in the North; I do not know as we can here. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 53

S. N. Haskell: You could do those things North. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 54

G. I. Butler: Here they would make the greatest hue and cry that ever was all over the South. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 55

W. C. White: But your road runs between, and makes a good division. It does not need to be the same; it can be separate places, separate ownership, and I don’t think—it seemed to me this way. If the Lord has presented this to her, and she has led out in this presentation to us more than half a dozen times, and now she says it has been presented to her, and if He has, it seemed to me that we ought to put our ingenuity to work, together, to make it possible. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 56

G. I. Butler: Just as quick as these men that do not like us, who want to shut us down, just as quick as they have any sort of chance—those schools are in close connection, they can correspond with each other—you see if they don’t. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 57

E. G. White: If that plan has to be destroyed, we have to find something else. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 58

(S. N. Haskell: spoke of the possibility of “sounding” business friends in Nashville regarding public sentiment on this matter.) 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 59

W. C. White: Every time that Mother has been presented this, she has said that they should be distinct and separate, and yet she has said that they could be near enough together so that teachers could counsel together. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 60

(S. N. Haskell told of ostracism against white teachers in colored schools in Nashville.) 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 61

(Elder Butler also spoke of this matter.) 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 62

E. G. White: We are not in a situation now to have such a thing tested. We want first to get where we can get at the people, and get them aroused. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 63

J. E. White: There is one other thing that comes into that, and in very prominently, and that is the kind of a school you give the colored people. You can go down-town here and tell these people that you are going to open a school for colored people, and make school teachers and ministers and lawyers out of them, and they will be down on it at once; but you tell them that you are going to train nurses, and train them to be able to help, to be good cooks, and that sort of thing, and give them a good education in that sort of line, and they will say, “Good, that is what the country needs.” 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 64

E. G. White: If you can bring it in in that line, that is all the education that is necessary. Now here is St. Louis, and here are all these cities—I don’t know how it is people that are in the South here, with this message, and these cities unworked, can come up to the Judgment and feel excused before God—I don’t know how they can do it; I don’t know how God can say, “Well done, good and faithful servant.” [Matthew 25:23.] 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 65

Smith Sharp: There is a point you mentioned about Graysville that I would like to know if I understand correctly: Do you mean, in view of the destitute condition all over the South, that we have built too largely on the sanitarium and school? 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 66

E. G. White: No; I don’t mean that. I think that that is all right; but I think while you see them in such a condition as they are, I think that if you had delayed some things, and helped them a little to help themselves, I think it would have been loving your neighbor as yourself. I don’t think that the sanitarium is any too large; I think the buildings are very proper there; I know as they are not any too large. I think they are comfortable and proper, and it is proportionate to the place. After a while, when you were prospering, I think you could have managed to give them some advantage by advice and counsel and by even sharing means with them until their means could come in, or do something—I do not know how you could have done it. I think there is a very good presentation at Graysville. I don’t know as there is too much for it; but I think they have gotten to a spot where they can, if they strain a little, do something for Huntsville. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 67

If you had been placed as we have been placed, there in Australia, I will tell you what, you would have had to have done something. We have looked at the right hand and we have looked at the left hand, and we have done everything that mortals could do. And I thank God that we have done it; that is what I think, and I feel very grateful to think. I have a splendid letter from Sister Kress; she says we have our sanitarium. All our highest rooms are filled, and she says we are doing well now, and we are laying by—we are paying all the interest, and the taxes, and all these things—and we are laying by eight pounds, I think it was, a week; but I read it: they are gathering and paying off their bills, and their expenses, so that they feel very cheerful and glad. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 68

G. I. Butler: We wish you could be here in a few months—three or four months—and I think we could show you a better state of things over there. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 69

E. G. White: I believe it. There is nothing in the world like “gitting up and git.” 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 70

G. I. Butler: There are some things that you have settled, about selling the land, etc. Your testimony has settled those things forever. Now we are going to fix that thing up. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 71

E. G. White: Someone proposed that we have colored families come in there, and have the families these students belonged to. They could not do a worse thing for those students than that thing. Those students have to forget their home life. They have to forget it, and they have to come under discipline; and if things don’t go right, they won’t run right to their parents and tell them and expatiate and get them all into trouble, and have those colored families right at them—they can’t do it. They can’t take all these families on them; but there can be ways that I think that land can be utilized, if they cannot make a school. (I wish they could.) But if they could not do even the cooking school and the sanitarium, and how to treat the sick, you can get them up and give them an education. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 72

J. E. White: You know families often leave to go where there is a school, so that they can be there to educate the children. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 73

Question: Sister White, what was mentioned at Huntsville about bringing families to Huntsville? 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 74

E. G. White: Now, I will tell you how it was with our school. The light given me was that there were no parents that were to come in for the white school. They were not to go and settle themselves down all right around us there; they were not to do it. And the first thing when they came, you know, and they wanted a place right by the school. Well, now, the light had been given me, that it should not be. They would be in a quarrel all the time, that something is out of gear, and something is out of the way. We would not permit them to settle right around there; they had to go off a little way. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 75

W. C. White: There was another proposition different from the one we have been discussing, that I understood you favored at the time, perhaps I did not understand—that the farm is much too large. We think that 200 acres is all that the students can handle to advantage. There was a proposition that we rent a portion of the farm to colored families, and then let them have a little church school for their own children, down on the other end of the farm; and separate from the training school altogether. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 76

E. G. White: Oh, I should not see anything about that that would be a good idea. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 77

J. E. White: There is one point that has never been considered much, and I mentioned it to you, and that was the need of a place for orphan children, and children that would be brought up in wickedness at home, in spite of everything about that place; and every school that we have of that kind. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 78

E. G. White: Yes, the orphan children should be looked after. It is better to have a little company, instead of building a great building, especially to take care of orphans. But if it could be so that there could be a preparation like that, I think it would be a great blessing. We have to do some such things, or we will just as surely neglect our work, just as surely get into trouble about our duty to the orphans and those that need attention. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 79

J. E. White: There are people living right around our schools that will be anxious to send their children to our school; that case is different, is it not? 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 80

E. G. White: I would gather in all I could possibly get; I would get acquainted with them, and gather them in. In that way you are instructing them and they can take the truth and carry it into their families. And as you work on that plan, I know the Lord will lead out, and you will feel that the hand of the Lord is with you. I wish that this man that is going away, I wish that he would feel that he could just take right hold with you and work with you, but if he does not feel that, perhaps the best thing would be to let him go. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 81

Smith Sharp: I stayed there and helped them to harvest, and he and I shocked oats together, and he did not intimate that he could not work with Brother Rogers. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 82

E. G. White: Well, I knew that there would be a difficulty with the colored ones, and I thought perhaps it would be thus with this our brother, but it would be for his good, for it is a sad thing to get an idea that they could not work with Brother Rogers, because it is a sin to feel that way. Now Brother Nicola, I feel sorry for Brother Nicola. It is because he has not had the blending of the mind and the education of the mind so that he can carry a controlling influence, and yet he assumes that he can do it all. He has not that controlling influence, like government, in his own children; he does not understand; and now then, how can he govern a school? That is the question. And I wish that these brethren could blend together, because I do not want Brother Rogers to take the responsibility so much that he cannot give some influence in a place, and some advice and counsel. I don’t like it to be put in that phase. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 83

There is nothing under the sun in any of these enterprises—nothing under the sun like a heave-e-o-heave, and success to bring success. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 84

S. N. Haskell: That is true; there is nothing succeeds like success. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 85

E. G. White: Yes, it is success, and you can make it; you can determine to make it; you can have everything. 19LtMs, Ms 152, 1904, par. 86